UWM (UWMC) 6 Aug 242024 Q2 Earnings call transcript

Ladies and gentlemen, good morning. My name is Abby, and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to the UWM Holdings Corporation Second Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference Call.

[Operator Instructions]

And Blake Kolo, you may begin your conference.

morning. Good Kolo, and Blake Relations. of Business Chief is Head Officer Investor This you welcome Corporation's UWM and joining Earnings the Thank us, XXXX to for Second Quarter Call. Holdings

conference to we everyone Before would forward-looking like I that start, this call includes statements. remind

may this factors materially statements, morning. to For refer results release earnings forward-looking actual that information to cause more that please our about differ from we issued

also today will include commentary measures. non-GAAP Our financial

the our and reported non-GAAP metrics and reconciliations non-GAAP For the metrics GAAP release as for the please information earlier our on earnings results, between the to filings refer today the SEC. issued well with as

turn I and now and Wholesale CEO to UWM the will Mat United Ishbia, Chairman call over Mortgage. Corporation Holdings of

Thanks, Blake, and you, for thank everyone, joining today. us

had UWM which same. market been half details, been might tremendous in the here year is we'll upside about better there's soon, a in soon. people lies we've the winning. market, are versus we'll has And later. But would living For The better industry that go that XXXX. than UWM might a for ahead. better a XXXX through industry first it of the We still our be quarter, saying XXXX winning. purchase-driven the an but better Most which hasn't amazing although been but been talk volume has bit market yet, the about much now, be little XXXX at be the production while getting getting

market XXXX. for latest shows to share the post stayed since data have continues higher channel highest increases rates the longer, channel broker While the as share

officers it's wholesale. excited to happen. starting see about the that loan migrating retail from to and continue We're So to upside data on we mortgage

put buzz here first which of on campus investment Now were our LIVE! UWM saw you And there's in and continued technology, saw those and that many focus at as tremendous our cuts production the we UWM in the anticipate significant in in handle Fed a XX rate over months. XX the community to next multiple increases that to the broker times when position

quarter compare from was a our great coming performance. second within let's total over at purchase. Now $XX Whether second with production or sequentially, the guidance billion billion year-over-year the we closed in quarter. $XX.X We look quarter

up ] X% more XX% the of first compared Our quarter this 'XX production and the [ from second up is quarter year. impressive to

XXXX. In our fact, production it was quarterly the of quarter since first highest

of Our at the $XXX margin higher of basis gain million, out over net our that generated control. of the MSRs, of In on that excited we of is see value a the and interest in add XXX points and XXXX speed just and on didn't channel announced into tied things to come products these rates a We're action. guidance, fair of that the technology income really to end exist capacity decline which includes and second and was we $XX million XXXX. quarter, number really and broker

and advantage This broker outside of no brokers. so company handle title everything First, website now huge is saves it going taking closing the a official dollars and enables go longer closing, day. disbursement, it our UWM anyone outside, changer, of more every title, the or right from mortgagematchup, WNBA, consumer has of from and and are game work many people to the our single Tracks, with partner to consumer-facing is we're and more and and the NBA third-party thousands seeing times. to the a mortgage we're which this process website, now

our coordinator will come as immediately processor line process assist plus brokerage, is their rates adds critical This to want become to which which scaled a Plus, brokers, PA choose capacity and they processes loan part loan down. of which We the UWM more handle.

approval market rates of underwriting brokers as will in impact these they technology you UWM pulling rest will in system. apparent we see continue community is it with business more known heavily are enter we the are investments XX invest day and allowing drop. single when a underwriting get speed a of our the for market, minutes UWM our [indiscernible] where on The more to initial able as underwriters To refi every and add will to bluntly, to service allows the we still thriving maintaining broker the do are full and drop the for. little be to and weight and in Finally, while lot This ready than processes. also the volume brokers when the put of significantly increase and

excited guys You I my excited I'm more workers, is we as XX never are the UWM now. years felt and I'm business, the But for in know about right me and prepared opportunity know ever.

and building we're excited. prepared, are we've We this opportunity, been and for super

to our and and Now Hubacker, come I'll turn CFO, chat Andrew over things then later. I'll back

quarter quarter net performance, the positive financial for Thank GAAP year-to-date. pleased were second our and you, reporting income Mat. We with

is and the channel to remain in year-to-date is allowed our Importantly, we the year. of of people, also broker our $XX.X in to on points gain and profitability. us approximate the an basis is fair XX% gain the last net operationally technology increases XXXX growth MSRs, adjusted margin continue EBITDA XX while of X outside of Total the value of volume before control. basis period largely which maintaining in significantly billion invest from an months increase change volume considering and These from in of first profitable XXX same up in our have margin basis points and production

the of to sheet, us significantly sales have on close net proceeds allowed production billion our sales our business have portfolio. $X.X in we sales while been derisk consistent been have quarter, of continued our to used for the generated in to shareholders. these higher dividend our delever from and maintaining targeted excess our MSRs, opportunistically balance and and through also increase second MSRs a the bulk invest These coupon selling end During we and the execute Proceeds from strategy consistent second quarter. to at and

Most and our X.X%, portfolio with even Ginnie of declined approximately with servicing X weighted on months sales The production excess of were in X.XX% end sales rights were the coupon the from our our coupons Mae to at rates. XXXX average new year-to-date of of of X/X bulk above and first loans collateral. XXXX bulk higher

As just of our the and ratios and cash quarter, QX expected of and capital current no in ended the credit. environment. We our leverage outstanding $XXX continue end borrowings of fall total million unsecured MSR the an of under with or lines with on targeted to ranges

access liquidity and strong. liquidity very to remained So

different to market prepared continue be We financially operationally and for cycles.

President for some things turn Mat over Ishbia, remarks. our Chairman, and now CEO, to back I'll closing Okay.

getting share Andrew. mortgage get the It's Thanks, seeing latest through channel. and more way and the mortgage broker mortgage Q&A. a easiest American a few close with to a I'll the are this. advantage fastest, and affordable points of consumers numbers the undeniably before most validate their More

the before, of I As America. next XXXX. the the a best the remain industry say are were QX, market market, of broker would XX that we much lender in in mortgage highest than the last saw UWM refi I said in and in the regardless heading years. position we the But we'll channel achieved into share broker stronger in

for American the service providing to years for and serve #X technology to well as purchase or channel consumers. for continue wholesale XX to also been lender is making decade is last the brokers lender us us, To market this be #X they a a it's That for as focus broker what achieving the brokers. continue mortgage broker the and a target we're in team. America, -- channel, for Having so But overall focus one. best elite on years. our the going to will now focus best with share. Our to top consumers, X lender this mortgage take may number X over it's the as win years, going the because UWM. to years and We're It's best XX% on is X turns

guidance. to turning Now

our couple XXX We of refi of has $XX billion billion that here XX look an between margin made at, can right market days With we being be now. boom points. could between be the said, point $XX and expect QX production where gain last the inflection to and anywhere basis really and the

is Now and this for numbers, if tenure to if X is minutes be what want guys quarter and and will where We've to is I upside Obviously, right the rates company excited sure make a upside the a on mortgage be the now, this. exactly lot there about fourth not now, beyond and at. part they're at back from guided beat line, go prepared where I'm America. stays with XX XX people stay interest talk are about lay guidance to ahead. building this that most we to those to We call in in stay off. mortgage will best know rates the right The after up and XX rates I it's could I did but XXX the we expect production more we XX-year of perspective. and But you. in you this, been

about We I'm with opportunity. when the are months full refi refi we're And share the to that's shareholders the boom and X we a I in first the the at have boom, or position said And been you that future. to best what excited and all is prepared make UWM for ever about always money. the mini hit, the proud

if been market years. the we're going market the to of for And last have turns still dominate purchase in back, couple we the

see the the excited and So fourth we're excited about what's ahead. quarter, really ahead with third happens. to the I'm UWM. what quarter and upside possibilities see We'll

turn we'll to Q&A, there. Now go at the I'll this through time, it and over

[Operator Instructions]

comes of question line George Bose with first your And the KBW. from

cut but doesn't market, a and down expectations think of in of that you ARM and see points curve say, of the yield we as production could if in volume go increases? Fed that couple the much. Actually, does of pickup XX-year contributes the to a sort overall that forward Do terms suggesting, rate the basis hundred curve helped the by steepens

in in Fed question. the the much hard would hard between do just follow how a the described, there, some as versus time fixed. to also XX-year impactful understand general. not difference way, tenure predict I Yes. it have the markets Well, and in you for rates the thinking thanks XX-year Obviously, a are much as would it's opportunities out massive be possibilities all the movement the cutting

impactful which become the fixed But foreseeable market ARMs could XX move basis the points, markets I more consumer rates XX, and still station and every lead new for even will right best product a consumer rate perspective whatever, expects, the cuts Yes. Fed cutting think will in every from call that will awareness. we demand, piece even more the be mortgage will consumer Fed So when marketing XX, It's will the prevailing than XX-year broker be there believe the in world, the the of their September everyone the down. future. movement relevant? rate

how what we are on waiting very that the all yet, not a on and for interesting be. prepared So here but and will at of cusp we're we'll that impact UWM. the But quite out we've see been time very we're cusp. for, potential there shakes We're very, well here the

And guys insurers on Okay. Or with that save to of essentially that Plus guess, you does how I And where of, borrowers title do that? do reinsure work? then in the program work how terms like of actually, from you much structure -- Great. then Tracks program, this? sort how sort like

what's the X the it. does we different trying all with There's close as to it is We're It's Yes. at all on on through we or the different loan. parts to how better It FHFA, there's But all many at be our example simple, that. to it's X. your way it's going it's overnight, and bunch that's happen consumers. consumers. handle about Well, nuances title happening consumers. a for we're title for if little transactions process going all better I'm But not for happen and is the [indiscernible] Like because lot It all and doesn't saves transactions, the because thousands organization, in a disrupting are easy for a to a perspective, and to key a faster, that's read you why We're and plus. risk. pilot, consumers, Track another of taking title and we're it's consumers and better sure for what's of and but world of better winning cheaper. really an consumer to make from with look money, wins, easier brokers nuances better consumers we're always saving risk thousands

line of comes your Jefferies. And with from Derek the question Summers next

Track are Tracks, your incremental rates of any provide by maybe broker of those products and on Plus, on Or on partners? follow kind To how kind Plus any to PA other color could adoption you trending? color

the for Thanks Yes. question.

in our a happening X brokers innovation the not scale built and do that scale. So really things. in scale. couple How at Remember, parts I hire hit, actually can't. is hire title lost the up. gone prepared, not. taking are or handle much grow is pretty gain of the market don't has as double rates have out up. last the we X, good prepared refis adoption built because as have have today. technology and am business. share. in But UWM to What just business up I we've and they're They it. the level right? XXXX Nobody going How The brokers There's significantly 'XX, as back well triple significant one, The just hire to hired to brokers prepared, to to of up going we've well because don't of the for it's X guesswork What's the months. if equation, is PA up and Plus because we to didn't The can't say, handling Plus would able they a were companies I were with we're UWM's am brokers Track when that, not

Plus. and the PA basically is Plus so everybody." saying, Track Plus, out and Plus UWM "We've And the and included PA game the scale of for and Track Brokers got taking guesswork

pretty because So been expect it's the the a great, need market warrant has levels not it scale be the that right at now, but going they we don't right to doesn't now. adoption because

is been the through numbers market through where still we're the we've was, seeing. going where going the now, market Right and same

in right faster, easier industry a it's for does but now, in remove -- and -- lot it's Tracks cheaper. the Plus brokers the it And for it it and does huge for brokers is not bottlenecks only world, a and UWM, not scale our PA the creating that. scale. prepared We're So not word but of makes scale for Plus and

XX-year the Helpful then how a to really guidance. about Is just commentary there commentary to mortgage back on a that? where rally in gates or are your And open there. flood rate thinking refi circle on mind you

range that, right like I it know you, give the at XX-year do mean think an ranges -- So we're that it's than range, spur the exact bit drops the an start right? I give have -- it is good. number would little market But more today, we cusp, if exact is X.XX say I don't but now, the if in those where the I I can't think XX-year below refinance lower I a Yes. takes the from we're to now we're it getting number, will I boom. and on is down but what where if ticks down

on a I like of bit you And up yet. there upside. what little and minutes, said, gone And is you most But not tell XX. that this is we're that it to XX exactly a already everything guided we're for I'll I upside. after company so what has prepared is in the XX And today I there lot talk

and fourth further. likely about because could drop be almost. for baked exorbitantly I on the little could we're like you rates not say through quarter, refis higher this more it, a a if it quarter when But bit significantly business. mean substantial we a significantly, And most and a amount become so relevant, basis, drop rate almost this of quarter, if do numbers substantially And with for I more midway more substantial, is monthly August the think

question And your line comes Harter Douglas with UBS. the of next from

think up little Can of you a scale just kind made a your would about the talk investments in and the look in how this bit you you of kind quarter more some of incremental environment? and how significantly and volume volume expenses about

thanks for the Yes. No, question.

and we it. don't now. you'll in people. because we X,XXX I X,XXX when ready technology, know And that's talking in, you, about We've going didn't people it. We've we expenses we just preparing. building, lot hit like but out amazing it's So shots doesn't to we've very in my why don't in the are been volume we out off. have got been I some tell the come come, which it it's in every to a people right? we've only right we built very and been close, exact this well, I number, mortgage are for I've are want company dominated company, of last the We've you there, everyone of been some every we most that are -- But mortgage prepared on other the prepared. similar even to things like and are when hit, obviously that years, roughly built we this -- prepared. prepared. I we're the most look quarter, America not see X.X refis been and company speak We've outperforming see extremely mean are for we're most scale. about But the a refi amazing lay built there's

like getting in handle volume and manage yesterday, can of not and that got maintain in are significantly miss to higher, we've amount today a that the and we We been going before versus that. or that we beat, is what

when last the I'm technology been been to going like in we're day. thrive, And to the it's we're months, years are is X.X in going which country X all technology, the brokers training, I've company about doing that the for just getting benefit. And excited thrive, and get we comes, of not that. And know and day, And I mortgage people, but all come. that going in aspects and the we're at investment been been close saying not excited so it. the day. shareholders to last day has the the will innovation best And that our doing perspective the significant. to is guess my that in the is for waiting about we're We've process

Capuzzi line Sandler. comes the And with Brad question next of your from Piper

plan up discuss refi beyond timeline Plus. online or following transactions? this extend a you on Just Track Can to

Say that again?

are timeline the it's transactions? right that On UWM Track Plus, Is you just extend there to plan or LIVE! I a transactions. know out it beyond that like mentioned like online now, for capabilities refi that just refi

Yes.

is can like the volume. question can. The handle a I UWM -- broker I question is, title can is idea. of answer have double answer Plus. care UWM purchase Can So there's X allows purchase title question Track handle for is with transactions market Plus handle Track Plus. that think handle kind the There's to purchase we can because just Track in built volume, yes, they double the refinance Plus. along market, companies the things volume. handle all parts. notice, along UWM Plus, business. now. doubling is, Once yes, can the Track we to PA is We for lot the Track broke can Tracks understand title are don't a because business, really with and answer double of purchases, the right? company can handle right brokers Plus of And business, again, and PA a of companies the no what Well, So week's the the will about with

taking it volume hands into our that. we're is own so And right? for built a notice, the Plus Track X-day to handle So double in

focused the it's online, have easier, making it. I consumers. it's for actual have the built, so closings, And to process cheaper scale. on refinances, ability build I'm not I although faster,

we focus in-person it not And getting drop what tend for is hey, that can do so or on, am and and refinances going to almost is overnight. have advance big for. purchases, to Thursday, to said, I we although we're prepared Track close that's but some Plus of built Track, with what do we in-person if focused my it it, rates Friday, the I XX-year the happened like we're or And

an to adoption Track starting so number, to this people give to pushing substantially to a and adoption or it's higher people the PA what you and the Plus X the are starting last ago weeks works. has in months And won't are been because weeks try was it I've back X stuff I earlier -- than -- -- been early all the adopter, question, but is, how better Plus, and and you feel understand X

opportunity So your comes, when the double business. can rates do drop that you and

worry and that have your about UWM see back, because You happen. don't we to it will got

about very so and we're And well excited prepared, it. we're

pullback you playing just dynamics Have and an rational give seeing on broker can in then that more pricing channel? out channel? within And still continued you're be seen the update peers you the from

pricing to because day, rational pricing change mean like will a not drop can little pricing or for are rational competitors a don't I the more while. truth in going know can. to all feel Then XXX we're Yes. XXX I day. happens if our a and the today, they they maybe in Everyone I I concerned is wholesale parts they rates lot is like think much been are, double bring if I'm bit all bigger get general the start market, they small in about going than what a to a -- loans right? XX you're how them. has That's business. will of We're describing their right? busy. than And much loans of that then the people further

so happens And they is pricing. back what off

want retail. not whole But that's And that. we will prepared, why so that's the be have prepared, so are and we industry. that not that's don't to that People It's to happen. do just wholesale,

where good really about feel our I as very our are. Our feel about today. good profitable very, our We're pricing, volumes. stand really margins I margins, we

the team going recognize to when If realize of going X% job WACC these do our an now hopefully, around was huge MSR significantly. say people of our of rates lower caught And are values end And all billion Andrew, after quarter rates all this we've $XX did drop pricing, that, rational one but anyone MSRs. Now we that is at the it Imagine have right? you Blake, first you derisked here and with did than so range. to just to our So the plummet amazing thing MSRs. right? the

we'll you up, So it an write think to that everyone if origination but of we'll still write-down. of way, have doing have an going MSR a we're an lot is have MSR write-down, business,

So understand it things, is balancing I will think I see happening forward. those what's But interesting going to be that important people hand up.

right feel we're was be which are quarters our lows, because we're of still So about don't XX XXX, to quarter. in margins I'll going they be up. a than I are this boom. will pricing in how and rates drop a XX range up, ago, like go rationale, couple they'll off go that we're go next if They They able go to range little refi that a hopefully bit XXX, guide down now, further to good much quarter up, the the to to

expect further, to to drop Now go up. quarter, that the that next the rates question happens. is, if if guide I I'll for margins And

BTIG. line from comes Eric Hagen question next your with And of the

between how Following are for lower? up lower? are specifically, margins those in channel the you X Like you accounts channels purchase are if like feel if maybe even and rates like within on refi stable that point, differences what do do rates I mean, margins feel

just It's handle That's capacity. can't difference what is, Capacity. constant it. the people

lower. I billion about easy, simple, go good to billion. clean. day, do XXX, rates it's now, $XX to if really feel XX those it's is it's happen hitting to numbers, Right going all $XX what's it's So

we to number, business, it right? It If could give ranges. is our don't like rates there, could loans quote on down you -- all XX-year if said, lot going if range, and trillions dollars I'm And everybody. happen XX go the you XXX I that let's to of Everyone -- Now X%, substantially, just XXX not because off, it to want to that's range to do to going I'm could goes margins those the ranges a make I bets X.XX okay, the numbers. are goes up the drop, to X% just double from to X.X? the X.X% right? of drop if that's with refinances get there's a like literally could rates the in year, go numbers.

sudden, all going XX-year is And are a so of to refinance. fix X.XX people X.X, then,

calling to happen. And when to lowers going the refinancing. reaching independent about out start going think that's are and going mortgage to brokers mortgagematchup.com, Fed to and They're going rates, people

And MSR so on massive, will up. be volumes origination write-downs go sale and gain will

X.XX. I And You at, away does don't can take determine never I on balance it. control you that not we're it's the morning. write-downs. controls know what But so to it's nobody up. to XX-year, focus credit it goes we're want. numbers. know when not at. and again, and you credit market Obviously, that from all I'm those want whatever how be But can't X.XX, We watching and write-ups take MSR We when down. once We goes far don't for the this It could want already out? how it the X at origination

Chairman, So be prepared and it. and the doing most we're my the we as I CEO That's company. job just think to have

it. like We

to on developing perspective MSRs with mean, folks MSRs. the rates? up lower any see side up how who on Following the buy I demand show demand from lower you the for Do impacting see typically MSR MSRs. the risk values you the of

for if we off, loans originate where I don't MSRs. country -- We -- market buy lot sold and in rates us, in more opportunistically we originate were. Do see MSRs, more a than us, are obviously, loans seeing just I'll we the don't the originates that I know them. where so understanding which originate the first there's nobody

don't a MSRs -- because actually I a slowdown? chance. UWM a that's to only they originate. don't see need have That's can is. servicing I not have how loan They do so to slowdown And in buying the if a see have to people the We way know the loan chance. I'll have

Our and consumers. best the they're out for get the because loans brokers the there

origination, buying. buy about I'm and will we've who origination. to significantly, deliver been focus I'm now. to as X,XXX% people We still are of the right about really all going be on And not have the doing sure people brokers and being we're not is in shareholders that. not so mood like telling feel been helping prepared derisked sell because our to concerned being I making we've think and prepared, we everyone,

So because cash chance will lot will flows buy servicers interesting. be I massive think but don't for they a it beyond those buy refinance. it shift, a of to be a

Mark question DeVries next your with Bank. of line the comes And from Deutsche

of you're and I technology was more that hoping and mean kind close? broker how what to your we making within surge might the get channel a kind higher to significantly under your time think what share volume. if be you do even of for with potential to investments volumes improvements of in that take durable get a would the And sense

Yes.

in speed talk about close So go turn to fast with to the yields, XX, see little borrower close a the XX, my get by all in sugar bit XX loan close now times rates with fast leads, I'll When officially. the the shot. back to you're a and do everyone's turn long all standpoint, technology are things huge so fast but and times people drop, the in, the all we're bought loans need going the world a technology, days, that you fastest country country on, up

might it That's close days, and go XX, We or we to days if that's go a what everyone XX to will bit again. XX, They a little by else XX. loans. board across to works maintain might happen before, some what will get worse, day, the places is happened that XX

and levels our gap widen because technology so of because staffing will levels. service of and our our because And our of

going a because we've invested that of focus, of different some said, really focus we've X have wow working things going our at growing that's and channel, faster, to the easier that day, win, we broker the I'm ready we've day. not some all in that hold about. X focus in, to have the home. think, interesting in of is in all our in on we lot people X company the not lot X of Like into we means for win, some back the building. office, to the from as details I'd working to around all X,XXX every for we're talked of helping done have being I it's be people we all-in-X things the done, and people We built brokers -- have get because don't consumers. and technology what country of -- stuff But making on with really some goal They're technology countries rather yet a UWM team, helping America, and technology Now

There's some it. And all we're stuff. technology focused great so on

Speed in Some we about the will biggest of some They matters. consumers, speed are these about really And for are seen of to plus $XXX the is excited about, for long originators, the things. for shot. a matter Track have it. $XXX. people PA loans fastest heard you've by bolt and loans. trade Plus, with fast But they heard for saving But And but we and they brokers it country or lot it and compete you not you then lose matters, there's thing matters. and a loans, closing loans

comes next from question the line Barclays. of your Terry And with Ma

above basis gain a last X been the It's had the consistent pretty Just XXX on follow-up sale points. quarters on margin.

to So forward, maybe of gets raising of the I of what end is low the end question guess comfortable kind kind low the gets the you what guide? going and you

a Well, Yes. things move. obviously, lot so of

would won't have movements and seen a of impacts basis, tough XXX. volatility XX of XX cannot the There's pricing very as So valuations bottom. go lot were with we very, I a down, -- never that MSR felt be range But all people I range, margins we aware we've come that XXX, I which That it in that in hour-to-hour markets, pretty numbers. go think, would it's between day-to-day by. off down. XXX actually and That's valuations good actually to lot say back why makes hedging basis. and we're a on if on think the the back-to-back move never of. up that I go which the did, quarters, I confident

would like that, feel it's number. could XX, more I I be hey, so if And I don't never that change -- it the felt confident

Absolutely. I margins? to bigger the about margins? feel we good good try to XX Do So that. about have I is our XXX Do feel Absolutely. guidance.

rates XX could volatility this go there's of aspects. But movement up, happen. there's still things could quarter, lot of Rates days down, in left that impacts, go hedges, a lot a

feel so the And XXX. is bottom. off to keeping about question good. what about We XX that to the good range And then move make will me

moving that next I rates bottom off I a bit see quarter. further. think little drop the if myself could

steadiness still that. that can XXX know, up at could look I the does. I a is in for that a again said, XXX about bottom quarters if ability more bit potentially level next But the XX that couple the the down and But at next quarter X to based not dip, X And capacity on rates see we a confident or market. quarter, rates I like move It a hopefully haven't bit what of X this I'm the take yet, off it's different moving on I think levels, number little of if all level come think further. that number we'll XX looked number. not next I little there. in market be to a our and quarter feel I excited a I the

then you've Okay. just Got guys you at point. the meaningfully you mentioned MSR but derisked mentioned That's And be it. helpful opportunistic, on sales, would you also color. this

appetite still about maybe demand going guess I to loans forward, higher the talk just given your there? just can you sell coupon So

and year. scale, the year We're it's to X selling in We're sell Like focused not on we a derisk, expected. prepare to was we MSRs. with opportunistic MSRs months was The strategy first strategy in playing coming for Yes. and operationally really everything technology out of had X how this to the with it.

saying won't try to buy we all I'm to not so people time And call them. us sell MSRs more any the because

scale in on and right we're focused that's it's mine focus not my of now, now. right origination, now, a dominance on and industry this what on right focus However,

Possibly, So more? but right we focused we're those sell organization will because mine things. now it's our not on a or of other focus

question comes with And your the from of of Bank line Shelly Ryan final America.

noticed had direct in that a I up quarter. expenses quick pretty costs the on production I significantly just were loan here. one

any provide just could there and color as well you as If G&A.

would you Just factors and provide consider forward, that be could great. there any color to looking

Yes.

lot will a and say But inventory don't to have anymore gain competitors different because up. expenses a gone don't more about focused the big hear because focused credit a about haven't So purchases I going be nuances for which talking production refinances are of I which an up. changed. It's revenue, more costs opportunity, their it's naturally, lot really where I game talking being channel which losses different pick not when is I'd We there's been opportunity have cover expense, even origination, all of the much A reports. sell of broker houses, purchase playing my on up. that up, who little lot cutting expenses, hit guess loan the the a are of on to when focus have lot brokers And swing pick you I'm them because and much rates things. you're prepared growing. of on will a things the I loan opportunity. a right? with mode, not of along on We're winning But like people that on sale, do more, and refinance going focus winning, game is now, growing, help production, The I right on credit expenses, going growth heard you've more converting

the so it's like our to will really tied consistently expenses up expense gain, it's go relevant. it's And volume. and not loan production, with But

our good from just a members, overall team Our spot. G&A, like expenses in like we're pretty

team, got got we've we're really good technology. and feel we not our extremely about got hiring where but We're we're We've still systems, we've hiring, our high numbers at. our because

So on Expenses, The and is to being but game Liquidity are. prepared, the and we them, winning, MSRs. now. now. on We've growth, is going winning is derisked right watch right the right great. on we'll and focus now scale focus that's game yes, we're not

call up closing And Mat remarks. question-and-answer wrap that like portion. I over will turn to for to back the would our Ishbia

the great appreciate Well, very Really Thanks and that much. were thank support the all there questions you the today. for questions.

always a you If look Blake a we available on you follow-up, team, quarter. good and next to any have great quarter, other talk our to and Kolo one. of course, is forward Have

you conference Ladies gentlemen, concludes disconnect. now this call, may today's and and